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Pastafaries = Religion?
#17
(23-07-2011, 12:45)Gundi schrieb: Wir sind uns wahrscheinlich einig dass der ganz allgemeine Begriff "Gott" metaphysischer Natur ist.
Wenn nun die Christen diesen Begriff mit Eigenschaften ausstatten, ist das insofern legitim, da wir über Gott ja nix wissen (anders als beim Elefanten). Man könnte also beliebig Eigenschaften zuordnen und niemand könnte wirklich sagen, dieses oder jenes sei falsch (zb. die Allmächtigkeit Gottes). Ob das jedoch sinnvoll ist, sei dahingestellt.
Sobald der Begriff Gott jedoch mit Eigenschaften ausgestattet wird, wird er auch, naja ich sag mal angreifbar.
Bestes Beispiel: Theodizeeproblem. Und das muss auch so sein, versuchen wir doch hier einen metaphysischen Begriff in Verbindung mit Begriffen unserer Realwelt zu bringen (allwissend, gütig, allmächtig...) und schränken ihn damit ein, obwohl das ja eigentlich gar nicht geht (denn wer will das wissen. es bleibt allein beim Glauben).
Hier sind dann natürlich Fragen und Kritik gerechtfertigt.
Ein Elefant oder auch eine Teekanne ist aber bereits definiert. Sie mit zusätzlichen Eigenschaften auszustatten, ist daher unzulässig.

Der theistische/deistische Gott ja.
Du hast richtig erkannt wie sinnlos eine charakterisierung des metaphysischen ist. Ich will an dieser Stelle Nietzsche zitieren:

„Es ist wahr, es könnte eine metaphysische Welt geben; die absolute Möglichkeit davon ist kaum zu bekämpfen. […] aber Alles, was […] bisher metaphysische Annahmen werthvoll, schreckenvoll, lustvoll gemacht, was sie erzeugt hat, ist Leidenschaft, Irrthum und Selbstbetrug; die allerschlechtesten Methoden der Erkenntniss, nicht die allerbesten, haben daran glauben lehren. Wenn man diese Methoden, als das Fundament aller vorhandenen Religionen und Metaphysiken, aufgedeckt hat, hat man sie widerlegt. Dann bleibt immer noch jene Möglichkeit übrig; aber mit ihr kann man gar Nichts anfangen, geschweige denn, dass man Glück, Heil und Leben von den Spinnenfäden einer solchen Möglichkeit abhängen lassen dürfte. – Denn man könnte von der metaphysischen Welt gar Nichts aussagen, als ein Anderssein, ein uns unzugängliches, unbegreifliches Anderssein; es wäre ein Ding mit negativen Eigenschaften. – Wäre die Existenz einer solchen Welt noch so gut bewiesen, so stünde doch fest, dass die gleichgültigste aller Erkenntnisse eben ihre Erkenntniss wäre“

Menschliches, Allzumenschliches

Wieder zu den Parodien des Theismus: diese wollen aufzeigen, dass der Theismus weder belegt, noch widerlegt werden kann. Russel zum Beispiel rechtfertigt die Existenz seiner Teekanne mit immer neuen Ausflüchten, ebenso wie die Theisten die Existenz ihres Gottes.
Das unsichtbare rosa Einhorn ist eine paradoxe Vorstellung, da etwas nicht rosa und gleichzeitig unsichtbar sein kann. Es weist auf widersprüche im Theismus hin(Theodizee; Allmachtsparadoxon).
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Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 22-07-2011, 13:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ottaviani - 22-07-2011, 14:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 22-07-2011, 15:11
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 22-07-2011, 15:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 22-07-2011, 15:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 23-07-2011, 10:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 11:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 12:32
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 12:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Romero - 23-07-2011, 14:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 14:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 07:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 20:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 08:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 14:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 17:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 17:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 17:51
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 19:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 21:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 22:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 23:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:37
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 06:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 17:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 20:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 27-07-2011, 21:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 28-07-2011, 07:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 27-07-2011, 21:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 21:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 21:15
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 22:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 22:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 23:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 22:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 22:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 28-07-2011, 08:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 27-07-2011, 00:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 22-07-2011, 15:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 22-07-2011, 23:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 10:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 23-07-2011, 10:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 20:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 16:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 22:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 17:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Artist - 26-07-2011, 22:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 23-07-2011, 12:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 13:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:51
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 17:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 18:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 14:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 14:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 14:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 14:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:16
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 17:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 17:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 17:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 18:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 18:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 20:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 20:11
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 20:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 20:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 21:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 25-07-2011, 20:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 25-07-2011, 22:16
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 25-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 26-07-2011, 21:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 21:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 21:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 21:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 22:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 22:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 23:15
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 23:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 00:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 00:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 10:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 18:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 18:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 18:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 19:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 19:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 21:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 22:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 22:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 22:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 22:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 22:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:32
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 01:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 12:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 25-07-2011, 13:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 14:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 25-07-2011, 20:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 26-07-2011, 19:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 19:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 26-07-2011, 20:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Theodora - 26-07-2011, 07:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 26-07-2011, 09:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 14:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 19:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 26-07-2011, 23:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 23:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 27-07-2011, 00:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 27-07-2011, 00:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 28-07-2011, 10:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 17:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 03-08-2011, 09:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von ChinaBlue - 03-08-2011, 11:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 08-08-2011, 17:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 18:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 18:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von humanist - 08-08-2011, 19:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 21:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 19:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 21:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 21:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 08-08-2011, 22:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 22:16

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